Of course, many people come to these conversations so convinced that no shared meaningful measurement is ever possible, they would prefer to say: all measures are always going to be subject to goodhart's law

I don't believe that, though. I think for most of us, if you're going to take a medicine you will want to know how many people were helped or died after that medicine was administered. Measurement is necessary. I do understand we may have reasonable disagreements about the when and how

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